Discussion of episode 4.12 "The stolen earth" Aired 28.06.08 BBC1 UK

[Angel's vision]

WOW. That ending has gotta be a twist, and I detect that Martha will use that thingy she was given and Donna well I am picking up something weird about her-she might be a Time Lady in disguise RTD has been referencing old NuWho eps...

I don't get how Rose could be upset over his "regeneration" I mean he will remember her and still have the same feelings ok not the same personality IF he is regenerating.

Donna fancies Jack!

Just another thing WOW. Loved his parting shot, BYE! lol.Question is how am I gonna last till next week? Oh and tomorrow at 13.00hrs there will be a trailer for "Journeys end" Check the TV listings for what channel. The source
wasn't specific about wether BBC2 or 1.

[Mr Pointy]

As I've said several times now in other places...Bloody Brilliant! I just hope the next ep can follow it.

The trailer for Journey's End is on the BBC Who site - BBC - Doctor Who - News (http://www.bbc.co.uk/doctorwho/s4/news/080629_news_01) - UK viewers only again I'm afraid (but I'm sure it will be on YouTube shortly :))

[Karma]

That was a great episode!! I love Donna's granddad, he's such a love!! It was well done how they've brought everyone into this. I loved that Torchwood have a guest appearance but the writters better not kill off Ianto and Gwen!! There the only 2 left.

I thought the communications scene was heartbreaking where everyone was speaking over their computers and no one could see Rose :( And especially with the ex priminister :(

I can't wait for next weeks episode!

[edb]

I missed this episode *cries*, my daughter was having a birthday party so my time was occupied by a houseful of 5 year olds! I'm now thinking I will just watch this episode and nexts weeks back to back so I don't have to wait between shows! :D

Although I'm gutted this season is over already. :(

[N4H]

That was kind of a smorgasbord, feast for the fans, wasn't it?

It was almost like Davies is himself a fan, and he threw in everything the fan in him wanted to see. A lot of that fantasy masquerading as sci fi stuff he likes to do, but I forgive him. When you're trying to jam that much in you need a few shortcuts.

Great stuff for me, but I'd hate to be a Doctor Who noob and try to make sense of all that.

I'm on board with Mr. Pointy on his "the severed hand will regenerate Tennant as the Doctor" theory. A bit of a cheap trick maybe, but hey, I'll take it.

At this point for my own personal reference I'm going to rate it above last year's finale, and below the 2 previous. I hope that doesn't sound like a dis. In my opinion Doctor Who is consistently among the top doers of finales in the history of TV.

Oh, and in the actor competition of best shocked reaction to the appearance of the Daleks, the award goes to...Elizabeth Sladen.

Now to find that damned trailer...

[Bored of the Dead]

:jawdrop:First of all does anyone remember this 'hysteria' from last year?
Tate suggest Tennant will leave (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/7145965.stm)


Now, I absolutely love Tennant. He has become my favourite Doctor, but if his Regeneration isn't real - I think I'll be pissed.

Here is an interesting thought - there are pictures of David Morrissey in the Christmas Special - what if he is the next Doctor?

On this episode, I think it was absolutely amazing. I have issues with it, but honestly I couldn't care less for them at the moment and that was a perfect HIGH for me.

Did anyone else hear 'The Sound of Drums'

I will be annoyed if Harriet Jones sacrifice was anything other than that as it was gut wrenching.

Sarah-Jane was unbelievably magnificent (and now there is a link to Torchwood do you think we could see her and Luke in the planned 5 episode series?). I loved her absolute horror at the recognition of Davros, but then she has a reason to be like that.

So many wonderful things going on here so little space.

I was ready to kick the TV when I realised there was no 'Next Week' while at the same time I think it is perfect. We had a three part cliffhanger though I doubt that Gwen, Ianto and Sarah-Jane would die as they are involved in spin offs.

I want Mickey and Jackie to save Sarah-Jane.

So much.

I think we should assume the Tenth Doctor is dead though because of how the him and Rose thing was set up.

I wonder how special Donna will be.

GAAH

[Mr Pointy]

Here is an interesting thought - there are pictures of David Morrissey in the Christmas Special - what if he is the next Doctor?



There are also pics of David Tennant filming the Christmas special...alongside his Blackpool co-star :) There may be spoilers...

David Morrissey to star in Doctor Who Christmas special featuring ??? | Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-561218/David-Morrissey-star-Doctor-Who-Christmas-special-featuring-deadly-Cybermen.html)

[Bored of the Dead]

There are also pics of David Tennant filming the Christmas special...alongside his Blackpool co-star :) There may be spoilers...

David Morrissey to star in Doctor Who Christmas special featuring ??? | Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-561218/David-Morrissey-star-Doctor-Who-Christmas-special-featuring-deadly-Cybermen.html)

If it was to be the 'Best kept secret' of Who, wouldn't it be possible that RTD asked Tennant to appear on set for a day in costume for some publicity shots?

They do just seem to be standing around!

[Mr Pointy]

If it was to be the 'Best kept secret' of Who, wouldn't it be possible that RTD asked Tennant to appear on set for a day in costume for some publicity shots?

They do just seem to be standing around!
Yea but...the much-publicised reason for next year's specials (rather than a full series) was that David needed the time off to play Hamlet with the RSC...this speculation is fun :)

[N4H]

My favourite finale rumour so far, of course, is this one...

And then there's this:
"I think a potential clue to what may be coming is the mention of Calufrax. The planet was mentioned as one of the 27 that was stolen. It was also "stolen" by The Captain in the original series as part of the Key to Time serial. Seems an awfully big coincidence. That was an episode that featured Romana (Queen of the Timelords or something). Could be a nod to her return. Donna did seem to have a moment of recognition just after Calufrax was mentioned. Could be she's Romana and doesn't yet know it."

More finale rumours from message boards HERE (http://www.tvscoop.tv/2008/06/doctor_who_sens.html)

[Bored of the Dead]

Yea but...the much-publicised reason for next year's specials (rather than a full series) was that David needed the time off to play Hamlet with the RSC...this speculation is fun :)

Interestingly I have been on Doctorwhoforums and read some of the interviews from around that time and some TV interviews with RTD suggest that the show was planning a years hiatus anyway to try and keep it fresh.
Add to this that RTD will have known for some time he was leaving so maybe the plan was for him to give Steven a year to think about where he would like to take the new story.

I will be honest, while watching the episode I cited the Hamlet-defence as my reason why it couldn't be real and the above was also give to me as a reason by my hardcore Whovian friend.

I think it could go either way and as much as I LOVE Tennant, now we have a Regeneration, such a pointless death at that, I want a new Who.

Edit:

My favourite rumour so far, of course, is this one...



More finale rumours from message boards HERE (http://www.tvscoop.tv/2008/06/doctor_who_sens.html)

See. I have heard that Donna could be Romana and the Rani and just had a memory swiped ala The Master and The Doctor last year, but her parents/grandad (I love Wilf) don't make sense then. I do think that maybe Grandad will be something though.

I have also read, but not seen, about a clip for the end of next weeks episode that has The Doctor telling Wilf that he has to keep it a secret from her(the her is not defined so it could be Donna or Sylvia)

God I don't know what to expect now, but at all.

[Mr Pointy]

Here's the trailer for Journey's End from YouTube -
YouTube - Doctor Who Season 4 Episode 13 Journey's End Tv Trailer
Oh yea! That's what I'm talking about!

Crikey! That Davros seems to have some issues, doesn't he? :)

[N4H]

I have also read, but not seen, about a clip for the end of next weeks episode that has The Doctor telling Wilf that he has to keep it a secret from her(the her is not defined so it could be Donna or Sylvia)


I just watched that clip you're talking about at YouTube before I came here. There's other stuff in the video as well. Damn. Wish I hadn't clicked that one. It's behind the scenes footage. There's some footage at Bad Wolf bay you don't want to know about.

[Bored of the Dead]

I just watched that clip you're talking about at YouTube before I came here. There's other stuff in the video as well. Damn. Wish I hadn't clicked that one. It's behind the scenes footage. There's some footage at Bad Wolf bay you don't want to know about.

Do you have a link?

Think is, I have heard/read some stuff that I really don't want to discuss here because it is beyond spolier - but if it is correct, ignore everything I have written above!!!

[N4H]

Well if I link the video will pop up. It's at YouTube. I don't want people to get mad at me if they click it, and what's hinted at turns out to be true. Search under Doctor Who Finale. It's titled something like Episode 12 and 13 spoilers.

[Bored of the Dead]

Well if I link the video will pop up. It's at YouTube. I don't want people to get mad at me if they click it, and what's hinted at turns out to be true. Search under Doctor Who Finale. It's titled something like Episode 12 and 13 spoilers.


Couldn't be an annoying ninny and ask you to PM me it then as I am having trouble finding it

Thanks

[N4H]

Oh...what the heck...

* Warning * if you watch this you'll know at least one thing about what happens to the Doctor. Possibly 2. You'll prefer to be surprised.

YouTube - Doctor Who Episodes 12-13 Spoilers 2008

[Angel's vision]

That Proves that the "regeneration" is not to last or there is a twist to it. What I mean by not to last, things will be reversed, and because finales end with a lead up to the next story, and those scenes haven't been seen yet,Wilf's and Doctors dialogue if true about Donna ( think there is more to her than meets the eye, What will you become, Your readings are different, they have been all your life, Sorry for your loss, (as in future tense)

I seriously don't think that is the end of Ten, if that was, I'd be pissed that his "death" is a cop out, being killed by a Dalek because he wasn't looking while chasing after his girlfriend. I'd want him to go in a heroic way, like Series 1.

[Bored of the Dead]

That Proves that the "regeneration" is not to last or there is a twist to it. What I mean by not to last, things will be reversed, and because finales end with a lead up to the next story, and those scenes haven't been seen yet,Wilf's and Doctors dialogue if true about Donna ( think there is more to her than meets the eye, What will you become, Your readings are different, they have been all your life, Sorry for your loss, (as in future tense)

I seriously don't think that is the end of Ten, if that was, I'd be pissed that his "death" is a cop out, being killed by a Dalek because he wasn't looking while chasing after his girlfriend. I'd want him to go in a heroic way, like Series 1.


OK I am all for spoilers BUT do you see what you have done there.

You have given some kind of Spoiler. This video link, granted I asked for, gave people the choice to click it and watch BUT you've gone right ahead and posted about it - yet bizarrely you 'spoiler' tag the events of the episode that is already out there.

Amazing.

OK, lets now assume that you only posted that last bit.

Are you mad?

What greater way to die for a lead character is there than the pointless accident?

For so long we've always had these heroic deaths when in war people die by being in the wrong place at the wrong time.
Plus there is a huge level of heroism in just dying as a soldier with no meaning attributed to it. Every war since time began the needless death of the Soldier, the General, has been counted as heroic because no matter how they died, they were fighting the good fight (their perspective!!).

I wish RTD and the BBC had the balls to kill of their character like that, but I highly doubt they would.

David Tennants Doctor Death would be the greatest because there was no point to it.

Besides, The Doctor lives on no matter what because he regenerates so no harm no foul

[Bored of the Dead]

Here is a bit of great spoiler/speculation that might interest you N4H

This is cobbled together from bits I have read, a bit of my own research and a conversation with a friend so it is probably wrong - but its interesting no matter what

Donna means "lady" in Italian; as others have said, she's a temp and tempus means "time" in Latin; she is a Noble; she was, along with the Doctor, rendered as a household god in Fires of Pompeii; she defeated the time bug or whatever it was in Turn Left

Im only a temp....I'm only a time.....

And of course....

Romana rearranges to A ROMAN

and a ROMAN speaks LATIN

...and all the words in Donna's name and the fact that she is a "temp" translate almost literally from LATIN as "A Celebrated Time Lady"

I suspect that this is all way too clever mind you so she probably isn't but if she is a Time Lady then I think the logic is that she is Lord President of the High Council Romana!

[Angel's vision]

Al.
Seeing as N4H has seen it,Ep and Vid, assuming he has cos he has posted here, I saw no need to spoiler tag my response.The very picture on the vid embedement is a spoiler.

So I made an error, no need to get sarcastic about it, your not above being polite are you?


My appoligies to those who I Spoiled things for, and on topic I think his situation is a cop out, sorry.